China and the future of the USA

[Bushwack]

God help us Zonk, I hope we wake up! I traveled through China a while ago for work. That country is with out doubt the most F'd up place I have ever been to. Can you imagine a country whose citizens are scared of their soldiers?!? Well believe me, they are!

Any way, having been there all I can say is I will die free rather then live under a communist system.

And F#ck those yellow commie bastards!

[bill_d]

A significant advantage a lot of these emerging powers like China or India has over the United States is the homogoneous culture. It is easier to get everyone on the same page when it comes to policy decisions and deciding the direction the country should take. This is regardless of the type of government in place; yes China is a one-party authoratarian situation but India, Japan, Brazil are all legitimate democracies/republics. As a melting pot, the United States will need a few very charismatic, clear-sighted leaders in government in the coming years in order to avoid being outpaced by these nations. Grassroots movements like we saw in the 2010 election can only get us so far.

I am an American citizen of Chinese decent. I have been to China 5 times in the last 13 years. The change over the years has been impressive. From squatting hole-in-the-ground toilets to western style thrones. Their middle class has been born and continues to grow and demand resources like petroleum and flat screen TV's, while ours has shrunk and been forced to make do with less and less. The government is more efficient than what you would expect from something that calls itself communist. There is some corruption at the local levels, but it is nowhere near what can be considered rampant. The party always remembers to regularly expose officials in order to keep the public happy.

I wouldn't say that Chinese people are "afraid" of their armed forces. But there is certainly more respect for them among the general public than there is for the American military among the US public. Serving in the Chinese military is widely seen as a viable, respectable choice, and it is more restrictive to gain entrance compared to over here. Don't let the huge size of their miltary fool you: a regular joe must have connections, phonecalls made to help get in. Their military's veterans and retirees are well taken care of by the state. You can say that about their cops and the secret police as well. I have an uncle, who was a high school dropout, never went to college, and was only able to enlist in the army cause his dad was a party administrator (who was also a Korean war vet). The uncle now lives in a house of equivalent 1-1.5 million US $ worth, because his vet status got him help from local gov't for him and his army buddies start a lucrative restaurant business.

Despite the best efforts by the gov't at information control, everyone is aware of the sh#tty things done by the gov't over the years like Tian An Men square and the more recent repression against dissenters in the Western parts of the country. It isn't North Korea. Chinese people know what the world outside of their own country is like. Even if the internet censorship was airtight there'd still be millions of relatives and friends in other countries (like me) to tell them what life in America is like. However, the general consensus share among them is that stability is most important for China while it is still growing so rapidly and that serious attempts at democratization will have to wait.

The crazy thing is that they don't really see us as an antagonistic competitor economically or militarily (outside of some Taiwan scenario) the way WE see them. A man told me that the greatest thing for the world would be if the US and China worked cooperatively.
Like that'll happen anytime soon.

[RANGER513]

China ?

Aren't we bombing them next week ?

[rgrokelley]

China's problem will be that they have given their people a little more freedom. The uprising at Tianmen square worked, though the overlords won't admit it. After the massacre at Tianmen square more and more freedoms were allowed by the government. They are nowhere near the freedoms we have, but nothing starts fast... it is a slow, incremental freedom. However, the more freedom the people of China get, the more they are going to know how fucked up they are, and how they would want to be like us.

The only problem is the military command. The generals lived through the time of Mao, and they want China to emerge as the super power. One big goal is to get Taiwan back and they know we won't want to trade off on a nuclear exchange for that island. When one general said that we would not trade Los Angelese for Tapei, he was talking about this situtation.

I'm not worried about the average Chinese citizen. He may think that America is really cool, but it is the idiots at the top that will set the course of the nation. Look at us, we have some assclown who has never led anything in his life running our country, and doing things most of us don't agree with.

[Bushwack]

I wouldn't say that Chinese people are "afraid" of their armed forces. But there is certainly more respect for them among the general public than there is for the American military among the US public.

Read respect as fear. I'm throwing the BS flag. Those people FEAR their military. I have seen it with my own eyes! They also fear the police, and any other "official" government agency.

When was the last time you heard of a citizen speaking up against the government and not being silenced, IE: Arrested, Imprisoned, and perhaps never to be seen again?

That country is as corrupt as they come! Yeah sometimes corruption is punished....IF the people are willing to risk all to expose it. And IF the corruption cannot be swept under the table!

And once again, FUCK CHINA!

[RangerX]

Chinese chicks are hot.....

[Bushwack]

DEC,

My trip took me to the following cities in China: Beijing, Kunming, Suzhou, Shanghai, Hainan Island, Guangzhou and Hong Kong just before the Brits had to turn it over to China in 1997.

I was there repairing anesthesia machines and teaching Chinese technicians how to maintain and repair them as well. I started in Beijing. The city is meant to be a show piece and rightfully so. It is after all the capitol. Everything there was spic and span. My first clue that I was really in a communist country was when we went through Tiananmen Square. (I always traveled with an interpreter) He pointed out the square and I asked him what he thought about what happened there. His response was, “I don’t think about that.” I asked why, “Better not to talk about such things”. I let it go, the man clearly did not want to discuss it and I could see that the subject made him very nervous.

Next stop was Kunming. Now the hospital was disgusting. Operating rooms open to outside air. I saw a surgeon swatting flies off the patient he was working on! Toilet was a hole in the floor with excrement splashed on the wall and floor from splatter. I asked why there was such a difference from Beijing. Answer, “We are very far from show place, no money to spend on the hospital.” This was a Peoples Hospital as opposed to the Government Hospital for party members in Beijing.

My experience showed that the further one got from the official seat of power, (Beijing) the more corrupt things became. All business required a small “Gift” to get anything accomplished. No gift no progress. The company told me before hand to expect this and just keep track of the total gifts for my expenses.

Later that day I saw a company sized element of soldiers marching from a military barracks. They looked pretty disciplined and I was impressed and asked if we could watch. My escort replied, “No! We go now!” He did not want to hang around and see what was going on. Again I sensed fear. I have no idea why, I just knew this guy was scared.

Last part of the trip was from Guangzhou to Hong Kong by bus. Half way between the cities in absolutely no where the bus stopped, border guards got on and everyone had to show their papers. One guy was somehow wrong, again I don’t know why. They dragged his ass off that bus and were busy kicking his ass as we continued on to Hong Kong.

Granted my experience is a long time ago and I am old enough to remember when communist countries (USSR) and the east block were real threats, maybe I am inclined to dislike communism.

I can say what I want about the president or the government and worship how I see fit here in the U.S. without a thought of getting myself in trouble.

Is the same true for the average Joe in China? Hell No!

So I still say FUCK China. One day that country will give us trouble.

[RANGER513]

Chinese chicks are hot.....

Brother..........I'm seriously concerned about ya.