M4 ballistics question

[Silverback]

See above. 2 clicks with the front site post down. Front site controls elevation, rear windage for zeroing there top.

Thanks, but I think your zero procedure is fundamentally flawed. It's flawed because you are zeroing at 50 meters (I'll assume it's because you are too cool to zero at 25 meters and to lazy to zero at 100 meters), which does not affect the internal or external ballistic factors.

[BadMuther]

two clicks down on front sight post raises the POI by .9 MOA roughly 1 inch at 100 or 1/4 at 25.

a2/a3 w/ a 14.5 or 16 inch barrel it's actually 1/2 at 25 Tater (2 moa).

[BadMuther]

See above. 2 clicks with the front site post down. Front site controls elevation, rear windage for zeroing there top.

Thanks, but I think your zero procedure is fundamentally flawed. It's flawed because you are zeroing at 50 meters (I'll assume it's because you are too cool to zero at 25 meters and to lazy to zero at 100 meters), which does not affect the internal or external ballistic factors.

Flawed howeso????

Your chart has no accompanying info.

If you are talking about zeroing at 50 yards, I didn't come up with that. There used to be a great site that explained this really well, but basically a 25m zero is a real shitty zero.

A 50y zero is fairly close to a 200yd zero and allows you to get a "kill" w/out holdovers/unders from 0-250. Center mass hold.

Not everyone has access to a 100 yard range, and while I haven't used it, Paul Howe makes a pretty good case for it. The "2 clicks FS" is a quick and easy method from switching back and forth from a 25 to 50 zero if you need to as in Ranger at Large's particular situation.

I've been searching since my earlier post for more data to back it up to combat the exact kind of post you just put up.

But please, tell me what's flawed about it??

[BadMuther]

Until I find what I really want, you can read this link on the IBZ zero at 50 method.

http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=18&t=328143

Oh, and for the record, I zero at 25 a lot of the times because I have too many trees on my property to shoot at 50. I use the 2 clicks method to get a 50 zero and then adjust as necessary when I can shoot at longer ranges.

[Silverback]

See above. 2 clicks with the front site post down. Front site controls elevation, rear windage for zeroing there top.

Thanks, but I think your zero procedure is fundamentally flawed. It's flawed because you are zeroing at 50 meters (I'll assume it's because you are too cool to zero at 25 meters and to lazy to zero at 100 meters), which does not affect the internal or external ballistic factors.

Flawed howeso????

Your chart has no accompanying info.

If you are talking about zeroing at 50 yards, I didn't come up with that. There used to be a great site that explained this really well, but basically a 25m zero is a real shitty zero.

A 50y zero is fairly close to a 200yd zero and allows you to get a "kill" w/out holdovers/unders from 0-250. Center mass hold.

Not everyone has access to a 100 yard range, and while I haven't used it, Paul Howe makes a pretty good case for it. The "2 clicks FS" is a quick and easy method from switching back and forth from a 25 to 50 zero if you need to as in Ranger at Large's particular situation.

I've been searching since my earlier post for more data to back it up to combat the exact kind of post you just put up.

But please, tell me what's flawed about it??

The picture I included only shows the trajectory of a M855 & M193

[Rangeratlarge]

Very good disscusion!!!

Appreciate everyones input.

I can and will adapt to my new environment and department procedure. Of course I understand the logic of it. I was just saying for ME having 22years muscle memory and training for 25 m zero and the accompanying adjusted POA's I would like to be able to articulate why I prefer my Patrol Rifle zeroed at 25 m.

Hell I'm just stoked that I am going to be able to finnaly take it to work soon. The department required class to carry it in my patrol car is in June. I have had it since Feb! I am itching to take it.

Had two call this week alone were I would have taken it out and had it with me. Very when others took theres out!!

[BadMuther]

The picture I included only shows the trajectory of a M855 & M193

But what does it prove??

Terry, my data is for 16 inch barrels or less standard m4.

Ignore the 2 clicks thing for a bit. I believe I got that from the Maryland ar15 shooter's site that doesn't exist anyomre, and I suck at math and explaining math, so I won't try.

I'll post some links from kyle lambs book and see if you still think 25m is a good zero.

[BadMuther]

[Silverback]

Very good disscusion!!!

Appreciate everyones input.

I can and will adapt to my new environment and department procedure. Of course I understand the logic of it. I was just saying for ME having 22years muscle memory and training for 25 m zero and the accompanying adjusted POA's I would like to be able to articulate why I prefer my Patrol Rifle zeroed at 25 m.

Hell I'm just stoked that I am going to be able to finnaly take it to work soon. The department required class to carry it in my patrol car is in June. I have had it since Feb! I am itching to take it.

Had two call this week alone were I would have taken it out and had it with me. Very when others took theres out!!

Did you receive my email? Was it helpful?

[Silverback]

I'll post some links from kyle lambs book and see if you still think 25m is a good zero.

Keep the 25 meter zero in context, Training a LARGE group of Soldiers requires a lot of time management. I am not disagreeing with you I am just talking about something I understand. I have not been a member of a shooting club, police force or Delta force...I am merely an Infantry guy looking at the problem from and Infantry guy's perspective.

[Rangeratlarge]

Very good disscusion!!!

Appreciate everyones input.

I can and will adapt to my new environment and department procedure. Of course I understand the logic of it. I was just saying for ME having 22years muscle memory and training for 25 m zero and the accompanying adjusted POA's I would like to be able to articulate why I prefer my Patrol Rifle zeroed at 25 m.

Hell I'm just stoked that I am going to be able to finnaly take it to work soon. The department required class to carry it in my patrol car is in June. I have had it since Feb! I am itching to take it.

Had two call this week alone were I would have taken it out and had it with me. Very when others took theres out!!

Did you receive my email? Was it helpful?

Yes Thank you very much!!